Hi Clint
I have noticed in various Forums that people are having the same problem with the CRW-F1 I hope Yamaha sort this out before it gets to OZ or you won't be Pleased !!!

Laffin Assassin

New Hardware & Software isn't released it's allowed to escape !!!

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Did digging around through my CDRs and I took a picture of them.



from left to right.
PNY (CMC) - Phatocyanine
TDK (TY) - Cyanine
Verbatim (Mitsubishi) - Cyanine-Azo
Yamaha CDM80BTA

between the cyanine and the cyanaine-azo there is a slight difference in how dark the dye is, but the difference isn't as much as the Verbatim and the Yamaha. I haven't had time to run an ATIP on the Yamaha yet since well... I gotta go exchange my F1 later today due to the fact that apparently there was a batch of F1s which weren't packed properly. The packaging material that they used weren't inflated, and apparently, the drive suffered shipping/handling damage. *sigh.....

but from just looking at the yamaha cd-r, it seems to be the metal azo and it seems to only be rated for up to 16x.

so it seems that the metal azo probably can't handle the highspeed recording.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Hi Graffitti
Thanks for the Info !!!
You also Say " that apparently there was a batch of F1s which weren't packed properly. The packaging material that they used weren't inflated, and apparently, the drive suffered shipping/handling damage"
Do you know if this Issue only applies to the USA shipments or was it an International Issue is there any chance of you finding this out for us Please

Laffin Assassin

New Hardware & Software isn't released it's allowed to escape !!!

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

well.. at the local bestbuy here in the US, it seemed as if all the F1s that I could lay my paws on to shake around and make sure the drive is in 1 piece is well... nill... gonna head up to the other local bestbuy and see how well their stock came in. Probably just a local thing. GRRRR... annoyed nonetheless though. If nothing good there... time to hit Fry's

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Yeah Graffitti,

I think the Yamaha DiscT@2 CD-R's are made by Mitsubishi Chemicals also...

The last CD looks exactly the same as my 16X Verbatim DataLifePlus CD-R's.

The 3rd disc I take it, is certified higher than 16X

@ Laffin, that's probably why they're taking so long to release the F1 here, because Yamaha know that we Ozzies will not put up with sub-standard products

They use the rest of the world as test dummies

_________________
You get what you pay for...

Questions? Problems? Search for fast results!

Edited by - Clint on 08/06/2002 07:25:18

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Yep. The 3rd cd is actually in DataLifePlus. I'm not exactly sure what speed these're rated at, but I think they're suppose to be atlesat 24x. Atleast they were bundled in with the 24x burner I had that unfortunately died on me.

Whenever I get the new F1 later today, I'll do some T@2 with the various dyes and take some pictures of them. I'm already guessing that the Phato isn't even gonna show up at all in the picture.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

HI Clint
Yes the Yamaha CDM80BTA CDR that came with the F1 are:-
Manufacturer - Mitsubishi Chemicals
Media Code - 97m34s21f
Dye type - 1
Capacity - 79:59.74


You also Say "Laffin, that's probably why they're taking so long to release the F1 here, because Yamaha know that we Ozzies will not put up with sub-standard products.They use the rest of the world as test dummies !!!
No Mate you have got it wrong!!! Why you Ozzies get them late is because Yamaha are waiting for us in the UK and the USA to test them for them then when we find out that some are rubbish or faulty we return them so we can get them swapped then they re-package the faulty ones and send them to Oz just like we did with all our Convicts years ago !!! But in this case it looks like they have made a big mistake and sent the ones intended for OZ to the USA !!!!

Laffin Assassin

New Hardware & Software isn't released it's allowed to escape !!!

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

OK, just experienced a couple of blue screens in WinXP. Inserted CD-MRW formatted CDRWs that was formatted in Lite-On drive and the CRW-F1 had a hard time reading them. My system froze, it took a while to recover. I reformatted the CDRWs, CD-MRW activated, and when I ejected, InCD 3.32 crashed. Blue screen pointing to BSUDF.SYS as the problem.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Well.. this is my 2 cents on the drive.

To me, T@2 functions works quite well. Takes a while to get used to the editor such as when you're placing the text to go around the edge. TY Cyanine dye is just fine atleast to me, it shows quite well. I've also noticed that the method that they're using to print the cd is a relief style. Basically burning the unused space, and leaving the used space unburned. So keep that in mind. Dark color = light printing on the cd. Don't even bother using the T@2 function on Phytocyanine dye. It's way too faint and I can barely see it at all.

This is just fine for me since for most of my archival stuff I burn to the rim of the CD and use the Phato disc, and for VCDS that I burn, I only use TY with cyanine which'll leave me space to label since not all VCDs're to the rim.

Frightening enough, even with the OWSC it was burning my 16x rated PNY (CMC) discs at a full 44x and the Data Verification on it said that it turned out fine, and it seems to be burning my 32x TDK (TY) at the full 44x too. No complaints here.

But man... god this drive is white... think I'm gonna have to paint my case to that platinum white color to match the drive.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Yeah L.A. My point exactly, you are all test dummies, then you report the probs to Yamaha, they fix, and then send 'em (the new, 'fixed' ones) of to Australia

Seriously, Graffitti,

If its good enough for you to see then it will be good enough for me to see! (Laffin might be going a little blind ).

I only use Cyanine based dye CD-R's aswell, as they are "better" for me. They last longer and look better

Sony CD-R's are very, very good quality I have found even if a few people tend to disagree. The older Sony's used to be made by TY, and are now manufactured by Sony themselves (according to the ATIP info) and the are exactly the same darkness as TY media so DiscT@2 should turn out fine on them .

You say the drive is really white; I'll just get the black version if possible to match the "black beast" machine of mine!

_________________
You get what you pay for...

Questions? Problems? Search for fast results!

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Here's something that's also quite interesting. The inCD that's packaged with the CRW-F1 is version 3.32 while the latest version that's listed on the nero site is only 3.31

any thoughts?

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Hello all,

Looks like I've got about 3 or 4 things to reply about, so I'll try to wrap all the items into this email. I hope I can satisfy all your questions in one go, as it may be a little while until I reply again.

Ralf Hutter: Sorry to hear about your "ass being frosted" :) I appreciate your comments regarding the write speeds, and it has been noted. Please understand that this drive has one major goal...to produce the highest QUALITY burned CD-R discs of any CD Recorder on the market. The OWSC has been designed with this in mind. While I understand that other drives may be able to burn to your CD-Rs at higher speeds, without the appropriate testing equipment, it would be impossible for you to know what the ACTUAL quality of the recorded data is. Yamaha employs 7 engineers who test CD-R media, and their job is to create a database of speeds at which each brand, model, and make of CD-R media is most reliably recorded.

Laffin: Sorry to hear about your first experience with DiscT@2. There are different levels of visibility and effects that are produced when using different media. With deep blue AZO media, the result is a high contrast DiscT@2. With cyanine based media, the tattoo has been said to be more "holographic". With phthlocyanine media, the tattoo is commonly described as more like a "watermark". Certainly each effect has its uses.

For the record, Yamaha in the US will have offer "DiscT@2 optimized" CD-R discs (deep blue AZO) along with the rest of our CD-R and CD-RW media line. The pricing will not be higher than our existing CD-R media. Also, the OWSC comments have been noted.

MP3Mogul: I hope my answers have satisfied your questions. We took extra time to develop the firmware prior to the launch of this product, so that we were not "like every other CD-R manufacter" who is launching their products and using the consumer as their test bed. We believe the product we launched is solid, and does not have any glaring problems or errors. However, we do realize that there are some features that users would like, and these are being taken into consideration for firmware updates in the future.

Graffiti: In the Print Preview screen of the DiscT@2 editor, there is a checkbox for "Invert". You might want to test out using this feature, to change the "relief" style effect you mentioned.


Thank you all for your comments!

Sincerely,

Mark Becknauld
Product Manager
Multimedia Products Division
Yamaha Electronics Corp.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

OHH OHH
*raises hand
one more quick question.

are there any benefits in using Audio Master mode to burn VCDs. Benefits as in longtivity and data integrity.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Hi Mark
Thanks for the speedy reply !!!
I do understand that you are very busy at the moment but please one last request please look at :-
http://www.cdrinfo.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5864
And just give us your opinion on Graffitti's Issue this is only a one time request to clear some things up and I would love to see what you think yourself about it. It is the same question that he is asking you on his last post on this thread!!!


Laffin Assassin

If you need the ASPI FIX you can Download it from HERE

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Hello all,

To answer the question, Audio Master technology is best HEARD when used on Audio recordings, however it does have the same benefits when doing data recordings. The quality of the recording is increased because of the wider lands and pits of the discs.

While I personally can't say that I've tested the VCD function with Audio Master, I have done many data CDs in this mode (even with the CRW3200 series).

BTW Graffiti, your support email was copied over to me for the original answer. :)

I hope this answers your questions.

Regards,

Mark Becknauld
Product Manager
Multimedia Products Division
Yamaha Electronics Corp.

(in reply to BinaryPoet)

Thanks for your speedy reply Mark !!!

Laffin Assassin

If you need the ASPI FIX you can Download it from HERE

(in reply to BinaryPoet)